Unfavorable mention on a Joe Rogan podcast two years ago

About two years ago
paleontologist, Trevor Valle, appeared on a Joe Rogan podcast (link here and below) entitled “Paleontologist Trevor Valle Debunks ‘Dinosaurs Never Existed’ Conspiracy.” Between 4:30 and 6:30 minutes into the podcast Valle said several things about me and this webpage that are not true. See below.

The following is a copy of the email
I sent to Trevor Valle. Another copy went into the comments section of the Joe Rogan podcast about 8pm CDT, September 9, 2018. Evidently there’s a jungle of misunderstanding out there that needs to be trimmed back.

Hi Dr. Valle:

I just saw your YouTube video on the Joe Rogan podcast.

You said a few things about me (I am David Peters) that are not true.

1. “He’s a jackass.” We’ve never met.

2. “All reptiles are mammals.” Actually just the opposite. All mammals are reptiles (= amniotes, under the new tetrapod family tree that minimizes taxon exclusion, see below). I hope you just had a memory lapse and misspoke and that you did check the site out first and not just rely on hear-say.

3. “All of these clades should be in this…and all of this crap” The new tetrapod family tree has a magnitude more included taxa than any prior study. Some taxa not previously tested together now nest together. Since this is science, anyone can duplicate the study using a similar list of taxa/specimens and their own list of character traits. I encourage everyone interested to do so. Note: DNA studies are widely known not to duplicate trait studies, and the new tetrapod family tree is similar to other trait studies in that regard. Here, birds still nest with birds, snakes with snakes, etc. So there are broad areas of agreement with past studies. Importantly, every branch of the tree shows a gradual accumulation of traits that appears to mirror actual evolutionary pathways. Some do break paradigms and traditions. Also note, whenever taxa have been tested together later by other workers, as in Chilesaurus, Diandongosuchus, Lagerpeton and others, their results confirm the earlier results recovered here.

4. “He wholesale copied from a colleague of mine, posted it, which is a violation of copyright, because he’s attempting to supersede that work by importing his own ideas to it.” Not sure which blogpost is the focus of your interest here, but I commonly copy and criticize pertinent parts of publications in order to help spread the news and, whenever necessary, to show errors and omissions. In science this is the process for arguing a new hypothesis. Copyright laws are not violated when arguing scientific validity. Whether it’s ‘confirmation’ or ‘refutation’ this is all legal, standard and how could we ever do without it? All work is cited. Often links are made to the original sites.

5. “He will refuse any critical comments to be posted on his WordPress site.” Actually just the opposite. I rarely get feedback, but it’s all there to be viewed over the last 7 years. I do edit emotionally charged words (cussing) from reader replies and I edit out ad hominem attacks as they are inappropriate for a scientific discussion.

Moreover, I make changes all the time whenever new data comes in, because, like anybody, I make mistakes, too. Nearly every one of the 1284 included taxa was new to me when I first studied it. Any scientist would say the same thing.

Trevor, since the cladogram is the core of the study, I encourage you to look at the site and tell me which taxa should not nest together and where they should nest instead. I would hate to think that you simply listened to an opinion without checking out the facts.

Sometimes it takes an outsider to shed light on false paradigms. I have been published in Nature, Science, the Journal of Vertebrate Paleontology, Ichnos, Historical Biology and other peer-reviewed academic publications, so despite lacking a PhD, I have made contributions to the literature and continue to do so.

A large gamut analysis of the tetrapod family tree has been long sought by the paleo community. Now that it is available online, apparently that’s not what they really wanted all along.

Best regards, and let’s have lunch sometime.

David Peters


2 thoughts on “Unfavorable mention on a Joe Rogan podcast two years ago

  1. I’ve really enjoyed your posts, and learned a tremendous amount from you. I studied zoology, physics and chemistry in college. I’m no where near a professional paleontologist; I just read and study for pleasure, and appreciate your detail and insight. Thank you.

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